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The ideal shampoo and conditioner
  • cyw
    If you could design the perfect shampoo and conditioner, what ingredients would you include or exclude?
  • Right BrainRight Brain
    "Perfect" is such a relative term that this is an almost impossible question to answer. Perfect for long hair or for short hair? Perfect for thick hair or fine hair? Perfect for dry hair... well, you get the idea.

    But putting all that aside for the sake of discussion, in all the hundreds of conditioner formulas we've tested over the years the ones that always test the best include a four key ingredients:

    Dimethicone to smooth the cuticle.

    Cyclomethicone to disperse the dimethicone and to provide some nice slip without weighing hair down.

    Note: an Amodimethicone can sometimes can replace this mixture.

    A fatty amine like stearamidopropylamine or behenaamidopropylamine to condition by sticking to the damaged, negatively charged areas on the hair.

    An acid such as aspartic acid or glutamic acid to "activate"and neutralize the amine.

    Of course there are more ingredients that must be in the formula to thicken, emulsify, preserve, etc. But these are the key conditioning ingredients we would include.
  • cyw
    Thanks for responding to my question!

    I've started to pre poo with coconut oil and then shampoo with a baby shampoo (as a sulphate free way to clean my hair).

    Would the baby shampoo be an effective shampoo with a conditioner that contained the above conditioning ingredients?

    Or would I have to go back to a standard sulphate-based shampoo?
  • Right BrainRight Brain
    Baby shampoo would work fine with those ingredients.
  • rachelm
    I don't know why but this conditioner (link to it here : http://www.boots.com/en/Johnsons-Baby-Detangling-Conditioner-500ml_6215/) I use for my kids and myself, it's Johnsons Baby Detangling Conditioner - seems really basic in terms of ingredients list, which is pretty short. But it really softens and detangles very effectively, even on my dry, damaged, highlighted hair. Doesn't seem to cause irritation to my sensitive scalp if properly rinsed off - I apply it to the full length of my hair, even my oily, prone-to-itch, seborrheic dermatitic scalp, and rinse off really well. Can't leave any behind or I will start feeling the itch! It also detangles my daughter's curly hair well and takes only about a minute to work on our hair.

    Can someone identify what in the list of ingredients are the chemicals responsible for it's softening and detangling properties? I've been really wondering about this. The list of ingredients are :

    Aqua, Distearyldimonium Chloride, Stearyl Alcohol,
    Hydroxyethylcellulose, PEG-80 Sorbitan Laurate, Quaternium-18,
    Tetrasodium EDTA, Citric Acid, PEG-5 Stearamine, Parfum, CI 47005, CI
    16035.







  • rachelm
    @cyw : I use my kids' baby shampoo to wash my hair and theirs. Link to it here : http://www.halosnhorns.co.uk/baby_bath.html Actually I alternate it with Halos n Horns Zingy Orange Hair & Body Wash sometimes too, depending on which one of these is on sale - link to that here : http://www.halosnhorns.co.uk/zingy_orange_hair_body_wash.html
    I really can't see or feel the difference between both the products really, and the ingredients list are very similar to each other... I don't think it matters other than the difference in fragrance.

    Both these products get my hair clean even though I apply L'Oreal Mythic Oil on my hair daily, which has Cyclopentosiloxane and Avocado and Grapeseed Oil in it amongst other things...  so I imagine it would build up a bit perhaps... that said I stay away from silicones because there are no SLS/SLES in either of these products - I can't use SLS/SLES anymore as my scalp is very sensitive now.

    Ingredients list for each of these are :
    1) Halos n Horns Baby Bath : Aqua, Decyl Glucoside, Cocamide DEA, Acrylates
    Copolymer, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Glycerin, Glycol Distearate,
    Diazolidinyl Urea, Parfum, Laureth-4, Disodium EDTA, Sodium Hydroxide,
    Denatonium Benzoate.

    2) Halos n Horns Zingy Orange Hair & Body Wash :
    Aqua, Decyl Glucoside, Cocamide DEA, Acrylates
    Copolymer, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Glycerin, Diazolidinyl Urea, Parfum,
    Disodium EDTA, Sodium Hydroxide, Denatonium Benzoate, CI 14700, CI 15985
  • cyw
    Hi Rachel

    I was able to find some pretty good definitions to the ingredients you asked. My guess would be stearly alcohol and
  • cyw

    My guess it would be the stearly alcohol and PEG-5 Stearamine that soften and detangle your hair.



    Stearyl Alcohol                                                                                                                                                   From
    Wise Geek: Stearyl alcohol is a fatty alcohol that generally is not damaging to
    the skin, unlike other chemical-based alcohols. A product that is labeled
    “alcohol free” usually is free of harsh alcohols but most likely contains fatty
    alcohols. These fatty alcohols can, in fact, be quite beneficial for the skin
    and are excellent moisturizers. One example of a fatty alcohol that is commonly
    used in skincare products is stearyl alcohol. Other examples of fatty alcohols
    are cetyl alcohol,
    cetearyl alcohol, and lanolin alcohol.

    Generally, stearyl alcohol is derived from text-decoration:none;text-underline:none">coconut oil. In skincare
    products, it functions as an emulsifier
    and an emollient. An emulsifier is a compound used to help bind together the
    oil and liquid in the product. This keeps the oil and liquid from separating
    out over time. An emulsifier also functions to keep the finished product from
    generating foam when shaken.



    As an emollient, stearyl alcohol serves to soften the skin. It enhances a
    skincare product's moisturizing properties and functions as a humectant — a
    humectant allows water to bind to the skin. This helps give the skin a soft and
    smooth appearance and helps to maintain that appearance. Stearyl alcohol is
    usually found in products such as creams, lubricants, conditioners, and
    depilatories.



    Citric Acid



    Adjusts the pH of the shampoo to help smooth the hair. A slightly acid pH is desirable so that the hair will be sleek and shiny in appearance.
    "Citric Acid... has a two fold reason for addition. Shampoos usually are at pH 5.5 because at slightly acidic pH the scales on a hair follicle lay flat making the hair feel smooth and look shiny. Citric acid is used to adjust the pH down to 5.5 (ish). It is a fairly weak acid which makes the adjustment easier. It also has a small amount of preservative action. Citric acid as opposed to any other acid will prevent bacterial growth."




    PEG-5 Stearamine



    I found many sites (by googling) that mention this
    ingredient but I couldn’t find a proper definition. One site mentioned it is
    found in conditioners that are detangulars.



     


  • alchemist
    @RachelM

    There are three conditioning agents in this product; Distearyldimonium Chloride, Quaternium-18, PEG-5 Stearamine.

    Water - Vehicle
    Distearyldimonium Chloride - Conditioner (a quaternary ammonium compound)
    Stearyl Alcohol, - Fatty aclohol helps build the viscosity of the product
    Hydroxyethylcellulose -  Thickener helps keep the product together
    PEG-80 Sorbitan Laurate - Solubiliser for the fragrance
    Quaternium-18 - Conditioner (another quaternary ammonium compound)
    Tetrasodium EDTA - Chelating agent, helps with preservation
    Citric Acid - pH Adjuster
    PEG-5 Stearamine - Conditioner (RightBrain mentioned fattyamines above)
    Parfum - Fragrance
    CI 47005 - Yellow dye
    CI 16035 - Red dye
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