hey pr,
thanks for the comment. interesting point. a lot of olay products seem focused on creating a temporary effect. i often hear members of my family remark on how well a certain skin care product is working because it goes on so smooth and silky.My understanding, though, is that that's more silicones like dimethicone that create that effect: it has no bearing on what the product is actually doing for your skin. I could be wrong, of course.

A friend of time bought a product by a company called "Say Yes to Carrots" which make a big brouhaha about being paraben-free. But when you look at their ingredients, they've just substituted formaldehyde-donors like diazolidinyl urea etc for parabens. I'm not saying I believe there's anything wrong with either of these preservatives. It's just funny because if a consumer is going to be worry-wart about about parabens, then it makes NO sense that they'd not be concerned about tiny amounts of formaldehyde being release in their skin cream. Perception is reality, i suppose.

Anyway, i look forward to one of the Brains' take on PTFE as well.

To be honest, Left Brain, I don't think it follows that just because we're dealing with a massive conglomerate like P&G that their products are by default safe and unproblematic. At least in the US, P&G, like all cosmetic companies, need only abide by the regulations set down by the FDA. The question then becomes: is the FDA being prudent in what it allows (and disallows) in cosmetics? I think we should definitely take our cues from scientists and not hypochondriac fear-mongers, and as you've pointed out before, P&G have the resources to employ outstanding cosmetic chemists who can research/test their products thoroughly and extensively. I'm glad PTFE is safe. But I take serious issue with your advice that "big companies" only use safe ingredients. Who would sue them in any case if it were discovered that certain of their products were not in fact safe? P&G would just argue that were using products permitted by the FDA, so there's no fault with them, the issue is with government, P&G would rightly be able to say they were acting within the bounds of the law.

Finally, Olay knows that their products are about results. Women will flock to repurchase them if they perceive it's working. It's not about what's prudent to put in there, or what's suspect, it's about sales. If taking out Triethanolamine, benzyl alcohol, fragrances, colors, dyes etc diminished the overrall perception because, say, it felt different on the skin, it jeopardized the "filling the wrinkles" effect of a product then sales would be jeopardized. I'm not saying we take our cue from the EWG. I agree completely that they can be alarmist at best. But I think we need to be cautious about what we put onto our skin and that means regarding ALL cosmetic manufacturers with some degree of skepticism.

OLAY PROVITAL PERFECTING MOISTURIZER, for instance, uses BHA. This is BANNED in the European Union and for good reason. So why does Olay use it? It makes no sense.

That's a great reply, Left Brain. Thanks for your thoughts!
Your statement: "Ingredients get banned for political reasons, not scientific ones" was quite thought-provoking for me. It can be so darn difficult to distinguish between what's science and what's not these days. I came across a website the other day which said even something like retinyl palmitate was carcinogenic. But then again this website seemed to say that virtually every product we use causes cancer and that we're only safe if we use their products, which are almiost always priced at a a premium and which are probably dubious in any case.

Here's to science!
Thanks for the forum. I'm astounded (and grateful) that's it's free.

That'd be great.  Of course, we both know that Sarah would never go for that.  She gives everything away.